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No change in Catalunya...

 
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Mark N

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Since: Mar 05, 2005
Posts: 650



(Msg. 1) Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2007 7:59 am
Post subject: No change in Catalunya...
Archived from groups: rec>motorcycles>racing (more info?)

Mark N wrote:
> - Michelins take the top two spots, but then you drop all the way to
> Hayden in 10th for the next one. What I suspect is going on there is the
> result of the situations at Michelin, Honda and Yamaha showing itself at
> last, those three OEM powers circling their battered (more or less)
> wagons around the two guys they really intended to focus on all along,
> and now we see the fruit of that. The caddies, Hayden and Edwards,
> finished 10th and 12th, over a second a lap back, Nakano and Checa are
> nowhere, and the Robertses even less, as is the French team with British
> (sort of) tires.
> - Bridgestone losing momentum in Europe? Not necessarity, it was just
> one race, with dry practice in short supply, and Michelin's main problem
> has seemed to be getting the right tire on the right bikes and riders
> under the new rules. So maybe they just guessed right this weekend, who
> knows. The 'Stones were good enough to have Barros, Stoner, Hopkins and
> Elias looking very racy and they all have different requirements, and
> the truly wet running showed their continuing superiority there.

So Pedrosa led the morning session and Rossi in the afternoon. But they
were the only Michelins in the top eight in P2, Michelin weighting the
bottom of the order much more than the top. And these items reported by
CN out of Italy:

Would the extra brownie points [maybe racing in the Suzuka 8-Hour]
improve Hayden's still-dubious status with Honda? Not an easy question -
but the answer was thrown into doubt when the defending World Champion
again found himself lagging behind teammate Dani Pedrosa in the supply
of special parts. He had expected new exhaust pipes here but discovered
on Friday that he wouldn't be getting them. "Actually, they didn't show"
he said, "or not enough of them showed." Did this mean that Pedrosa had
them, and he didn't? Hayden was somewhat circumlocutory. "Yeah, he...
well, he's got some different pipes. I don't think it's anything he
hasn't had before. But I'm not getting into all this stuff."

The official line from Honda on the new Dani-pipes was the usual about
the things being too loud for him on the left side. Right. Meanwhile at
Yamaha there was this:

Yamaha had exclusive exclusive special equipment also [In addition to
what Capirossi got at Ducati] for Rossi alone: a new, extra-beefy front
fork, and a new, extra-bendy top triple clamp. Rossi skirted the issue
before the meeting began. "WE have a different triple clamp for more
stability in braking" Rossi said. "It works quite well. We tested it at
Le Mans. The fork is the same." But the fork is clearly not the same: it
is as thick as a tree trunk, and visibly bigger than those on the other
Yamahas. "It's [the triple clamp] to put back some flex that has been
taken away elsewhere." said a team man. Taken from the fork? "Yes."

Back to Spain, we see some real stability in the picture at the front.
In addition to Rossi and Pedrosa, we see Stoner and Hopkins solidly in
the top five, Vermeulen moving up, Elias again fast in Spain on his
'Stones, but Capirossi and Melandri frustratingly just off the pace they
expect. And then there's Edwards and Hayden.

Also in CN this week they talk about the early appearance of the silly
season, acknowledging these rumors:
- Melandri to Ducati, of course, now frustrated with Honda and Gresini.
- Lorenzo already signed by Yamaha for '08.
- Hopkins to Kawasaki, Monster being the linkage there.
- A second Suzuki team, run by Schwantz, at least as a figurehead. The
team owner might be Batta, with Biaggi, and that's where the Spies
rumors come in (and you know Kev would weigh in there). But reported
more likely to be yet another Spanish team, run by Martinez, and the
riders mentioned are de Angelis and Elias. So do you want an outsider
coming in with 310 pounds of seriously accomplished riders, or another
tiddler-sourced insider with 250 pounds of occasional
semi-out-of-control speed?
- Ten Kate getting a Honda and giving it to Toseland. But Hondas are
in short supply, and Konica Minolta wants another, so Roberts may quit,
or Gresini may be out.
- A third Kawasaki, but probably an updated '07 bike run by the
factory team, no doubt with a paying rider.
- Vermeulen will also be on the market, but no specific prospects
mentioned.

The more things change...

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T3

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Since: Jun 08, 2007
Posts: 40



(Msg. 2) Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2007 2:17 pm
Post subject: Re: No change in Catalunya... [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"Mark N" wrote in message

> So Pedrosa led the morning session and Rossi in the afternoon. But they
> were the only Michelins in the top eight in P2, Michelin weighting the
> bottom of the order much more than the top. And these items reported by CN
> out of Italy:
>
> Would the extra brownie points [maybe racing in the Suzuka 8-Hour] improve
> Hayden's still-dubious status with Honda? Not an easy question - but the
> answer was thrown into doubt when the defending World Champion again found
> himself lagging behind teammate Dani Pedrosa in the supply of special
> parts. He had expected new exhaust pipes here but discovered on Friday
> that he wouldn't be getting them. "Actually, they didn't show" he said,
> "or not enough of them showed." Did this mean that Pedrosa had them, and
> he didn't? Hayden was somewhat circumlocutory. "Yeah, he... well, he's got
> some different pipes. I don't think it's anything he hasn't had before.
> But I'm not getting into all this stuff."

This part might be telling as well, "I think I’m less than a second off the
front guys
right now, but around here, I mean, that’s a lot. But actually felt
somewhat positive towards the end.”

Think again Nicky, you're 1.2 back from your teamate and that ain't too
good, but if you want to feel "positive", Okay...

> The more things change...
>

He's lookin' more fuk'd everyday and this weekend it'll be on national TV,
how sweet...

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kyle.edmonds

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Since: Jun 09, 2007
Posts: 4



(Msg. 3) Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2007 1:13 pm
Post subject: Re: No change in Catalunya... [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

I understand that all this is rumor and speculation, but......?

> - Melandri to Ducati, of course, now frustrated with Honda and Gresini.
What would that leave for Capirossi? satellite team or retirement?

> - Lorenzo already signed by Yamaha for '08.
Yamaha in MotoGP or 250? Is this Edwards' spot?

> - Hopkins to Kawasaki, Monster being the linkage there.
Is his contract with Suzuki done after this year? would he really
leave after the best year he's had so far on a bike that looks as
competitive as any of them at times?

Doesn't Spies have at least one more year left in his AMA contract? I
have heard him comment that he plans to stay in AMA for a few more
years and attempt to win a couple more championships. I can see him
staying in AMA for sure if Mladin retires, but Mladin's future in AMA
is unknown to me. Spies has mentioned that he would NOT go to MotoGP
unless he felt that he had a competitive ride. With Suzuki's 800cc
success, could this mean Suzuki USA giving him up to MotoGP dispite
his contract in AMA?

> - Ten Kate getting a Honda and giving it to Toseland. But Hondas are
> in short supply, and Konica Minolta wants another, so Roberts may quit,
> or Gresini may be out.
I don't exactly want to see the Gresini team dropping out of MotoGP
but a Ten Kate team would be a great replacement for the embaressment
that is team K.R. I heard a good comment the other day... "how do you
make a small fortune in racing...? start with a huge fortune!" -
i.e. K.R. get out while you have an ounce of dignity left.

- Kyle
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T3

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Since: Jun 08, 2007
Posts: 40



(Msg. 4) Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2007 1:13 pm
Post subject: Re: No change in Catalunya... [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

wrote in message

>
> Doesn't Spies have at least one more year left in his AMA contract? I
> have heard him comment that he plans to stay in AMA for a few more
> years and attempt to win a couple more championships. I can see him
> staying in AMA for sure if Mladin retires, but Mladin's future in AMA
> is unknown to me. Spies has mentioned that he would NOT go to MotoGP
> unless he felt that he had a competitive ride. With Suzuki's 800cc
> success, could this mean Suzuki USA giving him up to MotoGP dispite
> his contract in AMA?

Spies has another year on his contract with Suzuki, but I doubt it's
anchored in AMA, Mat's signed up till forever, or until he runs out of
places to bury buck$ back in Oz. As far as Suzuki's success in MGP goes, I
musta' missed it. They might be doing a little more, than say, a year ago,
but I wouldn't as far to say they're successful...
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Mark N

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Since: Mar 05, 2005
Posts: 650



(Msg. 5) Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2007 1:13 pm
Post subject: Re: No change in Catalunya... [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

wrote:
> I understand that all this is rumor and speculation, but......?
>
>> - Melandri to Ducati, of course, now frustrated with Honda and Gresini.
> What would that leave for Capirossi? satellite team or retirement?

The assumption out there is that Loris is set ro retire after this
season. Ducati wants an Italian on the team, and Melandri signed with
them last year, only to have Gresini exercise a matching option in his
expiring contract there. But if Loris doesn't retire and Ducati wants
him back, then that's out and I don't know what happens to Marco. He's
stuck in Honda satellite team hell now, reasonably competitive stuff but
not likely to win a championship. You'd think the factory teams at
Suzuki or Kawasaki might be more appealing these days.

>> - Lorenzo already signed by Yamaha for '08.
> Yamaha in MotoGP or 250? Is this Edwards' spot?

Yep, this has been the thought ever since he re-signed last year, that
he'd move on after another year. Julian reports some rumor about Rossi
on his own team and Lorenzo and perhaps Edwards on another (probably
Telefonica-sponsored, fitting in other rumors), but that seems unlikely
to me. Although Lorenzo hardly fits into the "Rossi caddy" mold, does he?

>> - Hopkins to Kawasaki, Monster being the linkage there.
> Is his contract with Suzuki done after this year? would he really
> leave after the best year he's had so far on a bike that looks as
> competitive as any of them at times?

His deal is up, but that's the question. If Suzuki continues to deliver
a competitive bike without failures or other chronic problems, it's hard
to see him bailing, particularly to go to Kawasaki, who have been in the
same boat as Suzuki over the years. But if Suzuki stumbles a bit, if the
money is much better, if he has team control, if he thinks Suzuki
supplying a second team is stretching too far, I suppose it's possible.
The Kawi seems like a pretty decent bike, de Puniet doesn't put it on
the front row at Catalunya on his talent alone. But you'd think
something like Loris' seat at Ducati would be more appealing.

> Doesn't Spies have at least one more year left in his AMA contract? I
> have heard him comment that he plans to stay in AMA for a few more
> years and attempt to win a couple more championships. I can see him
> staying in AMA for sure if Mladin retires, but Mladin's future in AMA
> is unknown to me. Spies has mentioned that he would NOT go to MotoGP
> unless he felt that he had a competitive ride. With Suzuki's 800cc
> success, could this mean Suzuki USA giving him up to MotoGP dispite
> his contract in AMA?

Spies is signed through '08, so assumedly his only option would be with
Suzuki, and with American Suzuki's blessing. Mladin is signed through
next season, I believe, his latest deal signed in '06 was for three
years as I recall. My guess is that Suzuki signing Tom Hayden probably
in part was anticipating Spies moving on and/or Mladin retiring, and you
can see how they'd rather have him with them in MotoGP rather than
staying on another year here and then bailing for another factory. The
Schwantz thing makes this more likely, he was mentoring Spies down in
Texas when Ben was just a kid. But the only way I can see Spies agreeing
to go to a satellite team would be if it was a learning year and he had
a guarantee to move to the factory team the following season.

>> - Ten Kate getting a Honda and giving it to Toseland. But Hondas are
>> in short supply, and Konica Minolta wants another, so Roberts may quit,
>> or Gresini may be out.
> I don't exactly want to see the Gresini team dropping out of MotoGP
> but a Ten Kate team would be a great replacement for the embaressment
> that is team K.R. I heard a good comment the other day... "how do you
> make a small fortune in racing...? start with a huge fortune!" -
> i.e. K.R. get out while you have an ounce of dignity left.

I'd hate to see Roberts leave, it's nice to have something other than a
pure factory bike on the grid, and KR has been an institution for 30
years in GP. They've had real money problems, and that's a large part of
why they are having the problems on the track they are right now - only
one bike, no test team, limited motor mileage available from Honda. The
new motor isn't what they (or anyone else) expected, and it seems last
year's chassis design simply doesn't work with it, unlike the situations
at Suzuki and Yamaha. Let's wait and see what they are doing later in
the year before shooting them. Last year showed what a team like this
has the potential to bring to the table, and Dorna is reportedly
throwing money around to fatten up the grid for next season.

Seems like Honda can play their options with their satellite teams,
picking whoever has the money to run effectively and the rider(s) to
bring the results. Pons is still out there, and who knows how solid
Cecchinello is. Gresini has been the most solid team since they had
Katoh, Gibernau and Telefonica, but Pons showed how quickly all that can
melt away. Sponsorship is the main indicator, and Gresini has been
dodging bullets on that ever since Pedrosa signed with Repsol and
Telefonica bailed. If Hannspree wants to go with Ten Kate and Toseland
instead, Fausto may be out in the cold.
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