Weekend Sport Riding Report - Finishing off a Pilot Power

On Sep 19, 5:17 am, Jamin wrote:
> on 9/18/07 12:13 PM, tomor... RemoveThis @erols.com wrote:
>
> > I'm not certain that Troy has offered a prescription for everyone,
> > only his opinion that sportriding in the public road at 140mph is not
> > altogether safe.
>
> > I really can't comment though, since I've only ridden a motorcycle
> > over 140 mph three times in my life, and two of those three times were
> > on the racetrack. Each time I did it, it seemed phenomenally fast,
> > and it also seemed that I needed split second timing and skills to
> > control the motorcycle, even though in all three instances I was on
> > wide, flat, straight pavement, with no intersections, no other
> > traffic, no telephone poles, no jersey barricades, etc. Just keeping
> > the motorcycle going in the right direction and timing my roll-off
> > point and braking point for the next corner seemed to demand an
> > inordinate amount of mental capacity at that speed.
>
> This is surprising to me. I thought you would have experienced more high
> speed with your racing experience.

Most riders with my racing experience, who ride literbikes, actually
any four cylinder bike, generally, would. I seem to go as fast as
(okay, generally faster than) them through turns. They go a lot
faster than me on the straights. I have lots of high speed turning
experience, not so much high speed straight line experience!

> > I think it would
> > be difficult for most riders to deal with anything out of the ordinary
> > happening at speeds above about 110-115 mph on the public streets, and
> > above about 90mph when cornering on the street.
>
> Most riders, you're probably right. We're talking about one rider, though.
> Maybe that generality doesn't apply as well to him.

Could be you're right. Could be he's one of the rare ones. I
certainly hope so!
 >> Stay informed about: Weekend Sport Riding Report - Finishing off a Pilot Power 

On Sep 19, 5:08 am, Jamin wrote:
> on 9/18/07 9:54 AM, Brutus wrote:
>
> > I'm sick and tired of the safety nannies in our society using the "save the
> > children" line to advance their ever more represive ( to the individual's
> > freedoms, including you and I dear mc riders) legislative/social goals...
>
> Couldn't agree more, Brutus. Self-reliance is a seemingly fading ideal.

Who demonstrates self-reliance more? The woman who takes her kids to
school each morning in the tan minivan, who, along with her husband
pays her taxes, raises her kids, and doesn't need or expect any
handouts from anyone? Or the guy with the Ferrari 599 in the (non-
speed related, wink, wink) cross country rally, a great driver who
knows it, who is, at 188 mph, approaching the intersection in the
desert? Where , icidentally, that minivan has just pulled into the
intersection at 10mph after its driver looked both ways and did not
see any oncoming traffic on the 55mph 2-laner?

RIding a motorcycle as fast as one is comfortable riding it, far in
excess of any posted speed limit anywhere in the entire country, does
not illustrate the ideal of self-reliance that I taught my children.

And yet, my grown children are, indeed, self-reliant.
 >> Stay informed about: Weekend Sport Riding Report - Finishing off a Pilot Power 

wrote in message

> On Sep 18, 2:14 pm, "Reassembler" wrote:
>> "TroytheTroll" wrote in message
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >> He had a great day out, he didn't crash, he was in control enough
>> >> on
>> >> the
>> >> day. No amount of 'what if's' is going to change that.
>>
>> > I got away with blowing corner entrances for like YEARS before I
>> > hit
>> > the truck head on in the other lane. But until THAT happened, man,
>> > I
>> > wuz DA BOMB!
>>
>> So how does that give you the wisdom to write a prescription for
>> everyone?
>
> I'm not certain that Troy has offered a prescription for everyone,
> only his opinion that sportriding in the public road at 140mph is not
> altogether safe.
>
> I really can't comment though, since I've only ridden a motorcycle
> over 140 mph three times in my life, and two of those three times were
> on the racetrack. Each time I did it, it seemed phenomenally fast,
> and it also seemed that I needed split second timing and skills to
> control the motorcycle, even though in all three instances I was on
> wide, flat, straight pavement, with no intersections, no other
> traffic, no telephone poles, no jersey barricades, etc. Just keeping
> the motorcycle going in the right direction and timing my roll-off
> point and braking point for the next corner seemed to demand an
> inordinate amount of mental capacity at that speed. I think it would
> be difficult for most riders to deal with anything out of the ordinary
> happening at speeds above about 110-115 mph on the public streets, and
> above about 90mph when cornering on the street.
>

I can't fault either of you from trying to save a stranger from
a horribly painful, or even fatal mistake. That would be wrong.


Reassembler
 >> Stay informed about: Weekend Sport Riding Report - Finishing off a Pilot Power 

On 9/19/07 3:52 AM, "tomorrow@erols.com" wrote:

> On Sep 19, 5:08 am, Jamin wrote:
>> on 9/18/07 9:54 AM, Brutus wrote:
>>
>>> I'm sick and tired of the safety nannies in our society using the "save the
>>> children" line to advance their ever more represive ( to the individual's
>>> freedoms, including you and I dear mc riders) legislative/social goals...
>>
>> Couldn't agree more, Brutus. Self-reliance is a seemingly fading ideal.
>
> Who demonstrates self-reliance more? The woman who takes her kids to
> school each morning in the tan minivan, who, along with her husband
> pays her taxes, raises her kids, and doesn't need or expect any
> handouts from anyone? Or the guy with the Ferrari 599 in the (non-
> speed related, wink, wink) cross country rally, a great driver who
> knows it, who is, at 188 mph, approaching the intersection in the
> desert? Where , icidentally, that minivan has just pulled into the
> intersection at 10mph after its driver looked both ways and did not
> see any oncoming traffic on the 55mph 2-laner?
>
> RIding a motorcycle as fast as one is comfortable riding it, far in
> excess of any posted speed limit anywhere in the entire country, does
> not illustrate the ideal of self-reliance that I taught my children.
>
> And yet, my grown children are, indeed, self-reliant.

I don't think reckless speeding demonstrates self-reliance at all. But the
key concept in that thought is "reckless". I believe people should endeavor
to honestly be aware of their limits, and should be free to operate within
those realistic limits, being fully aware that we are responsible for
everything we do.

My comment to Brutus was a general condemnation of our safety-nanny society,
which in my opinion contributes to the erosion of individual personal
responsibility. The more the government promises to take care of us and
protect us, the less some of us think we should take care of and protect
ourselves. By "us" I mean Americans. Not necessarily the people reading this
post.

--
Jamin
"Freedom costs a buck-oh-five"




--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
 >> Stay informed about: Weekend Sport Riding Report - Finishing off a Pilot Power 

On 9/19/07 3:42 AM, "tomorrow@erols.com" wrote:

> Most riders with my racing experience, who ride literbikes, actually
> any four cylinder bike, generally, would. I seem to go as fast as
> (okay, generally faster than) them through turns. They go a lot
> faster than me on the straights. I have lots of high speed turning
> experience, not so much high speed straight line experience!
>

The funny thing (to me) is that the last few times I was at a track day, I
adopted a similar riding style to what you describe: moderate speed on the
straights, higher corner speeds. And I was riding an R1! It was amusing to
me that the 1000cc riders would speed by me on the straight, tucked in and
hauling ass, but I'd pass them after a few turns. Then we'd get through the
rest of the lap and they'd whiz by again on the straight, only to be passed
again on the back side of the track.

One of those times I borrowed Dan Bannon's ZX-6R for a session, and I
discovered how much easier it was to maintain high corner speed his bike vs
mine. If I ever get heavily into track riding, I'm planning to acquire a
smaller, lighter bike for the dedicated job. SV650 with mods, 600 supersport
perhaps, something along those lines.

--
Jamin
"Freedom costs a buck-oh-five"




--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
 >> Stay informed about: Weekend Sport Riding Report - Finishing off a Pilot Power 

On Sep 19, 2:46 pm, "Reassembler" wrote:

> I can't fault either of you from trying to save a stranger from
> a horribly painful, or even fatal mistake. That would be wrong.

Plus, Vaughn seems to be a genuinely nice guy! We could use more
folks like him posting to AMS!

Irascable Tim
 >> Stay informed about: Weekend Sport Riding Report - Finishing off a Pilot Power 

On Sep 19, 5:17 pm, saddlebag wrote:

> Timsey, I've read your latest Bike Week story where you posted an avg
> mph of better than 90 from a reliable gps source.

No, no you haven't. You're purely making that up. The only GPS
source I've listed in ANY report that I've posted for motorcycling
lists one moving average of 77.5 mph and another of 76.8 mph and
that's on ALL interstate travel, where the speed limit is 65-70 mph
the entire length of the trip.

http://tinyurl.com/2ts8mf

So, now that you've been proven a liar once again, let's address the
rest of your ridiculous huffing and puffing.

> If I recall
> correctly, momentum = mass * velocity. You pushing a 950 lb bike at
> 100 mph = 95000 units of momentum.

Oops. Another lie. My bike weighs 770 pounds wet, not 950 pounds.

> That energy must be shed via your
> shitty Harley brakes that will probably warp the first time you had to
> try it.

Oops, another lie. My bike has dual full floating Brembo rotors,
stainless steel brake lines, and a Nissin master cylinder. The stock
(Japanese SunStar) rotors warped, the Screaming Eagle "floating"
Japanese SunStar "high performance" rotors (which were NOT floating)
warped. These genuine Brembo rotors do not warp.

> Vaughn OTOH, has a 400 lb bike driving 140 mph which gives
> him 56000 units of momentum to shed with genuine sportbike brakes MADE
> for stopping from high speed. I'm sure little miss mini van wouldn't
> expect either of you closing in on her from either speed and may well
> pull into either of your paths. Thing is, Vaughn has a much better
> chance of changing direction since his bike was made for it. Your
> Harley's mild steel frame would just twist and put you into a tank
> slapper.

Well, since I'll never ride my Harley OR my Ducati at or near triple
digit speeds approaching a grade level intersection, your attempt to
take a general observation and apply it to a specific situation is
invalid.

> Me thinks your Republican bred hypocrisy is showing.

And I think your liberal, proven to be lying, jackASS is hanging out
again.
 >> Stay informed about: Weekend Sport Riding Report - Finishing off a Pilot Power 

On Sep 19, 6:19 pm, "tomor...@erols.com" wrote:
> On Sep 19, 5:17 pm, saddlebag wrote:
>
> > Timsey, I've read your latest Bike Week story where you posted an avg
> > mph of better than 90 from a reliable gps source.
>
> No, no you haven't. You're purely making that up. The only GPS
> source I've listed in ANY report that I've posted for motorcycling
> lists one moving average of 77.5 mph and another of 76.8 mph and
> that's on ALL interstate travel, where the speed limit is 65-70 mph
> the entire length of the trip.
>
> http://tinyurl.com/2ts8mf

Oh, except for that max speed of 108 mph I guess you're right.

> So, now that you've been proven a liar once again, let's address the
> rest of your ridiculous huffing and puffing.
>
> > If I recall
> > correctly, momentum = mass * velocity. You pushing a 950 lb bike at
> > 100 mph = 95000 units of momentum.
>
> Oops. Another lie. My bike weighs 770 pounds wet, not 950 pounds.

780 per the Harley site, but that's before you put the trunk on it and
loaded it down for a week long trip. I'll give you 850 lbs, but you'd
still have to shed about 75% more energy than Vaughn.

> > That energy must be shed via your
> > shitty Harley brakes that will probably warp the first time you had to
> > try it.
>
> Oops, another lie. My bike has dual full floating Brembo rotors,
> stainless steel brake lines, and a Nissin master cylinder. The stock
> (Japanese SunStar) rotors warped, the Screaming Eagle "floating"
> Japanese SunStar "high performance" rotors (which were NOT floating)
> warped. These genuine Brembo rotors do not warp.

That's good. When you replace the warped frame at least you can reuse
the brake gear.

> > Vaughn OTOH, has a 400 lb bike driving 140 mph which gives
> > him 56000 units of momentum to shed with genuine sportbike brakes MADE
> > for stopping from high speed. I'm sure little miss mini van wouldn't
> > expect either of you closing in on her from either speed and may well
> > pull into either of your paths. Thing is, Vaughn has a much better
> > chance of changing direction since his bike was made for it. Your
> > Harley's mild steel frame would just twist and put you into a tank
> > slapper.
>
> Well, since I'll never ride my Harley OR my Ducati at or near triple
> digit speeds approaching a grade level intersection, your attempt to
> take a general observation and apply it to a specific situation is
> invalid.

Nice caveat, but I don't recall Vaughn saying that he did either.

> > Me thinks your Republican bred hypocrisy is showing.
>
> And I think your liberal, proven to be lying, jackASS is hanging out
> again.

No, you've spent more time and money than Ken Starr trying to catch me
misleading the public, but the best you'll ever get if you're lucky is
a pic of me in the back of a van with 4 smokin hot bitches sippin on
gin and juice.
 >> Stay informed about: Weekend Sport Riding Report - Finishing off a Pilot Power 

On 9/19/07 2:17 PM, "saddlebag" wrote:

> Timsey, I've read your latest Bike Week story where you posted an avg
> mph of better than 90 from a reliable gps source. If I recall
> correctly, momentum = mass * velocity. You pushing a 950 lb bike at
> 100 mph = 95000 units of momentum. That energy must be shed via your
> shitty Harley brakes that will probably warp the first time you had to
> try it. Vaughn OTOH, has a 400 lb bike driving 140 mph which gives
> him 56000 units of momentum to shed with genuine sportbike brakes MADE
> for stopping from high speed. I'm sure little miss mini van wouldn't
> expect either of you closing in on her from either speed and may well
> pull into either of your paths. Thing is, Vaughn has a much better
> chance of changing direction since his bike was made for it. Your
> Harley's mild steel frame would just twist and put you into a tank
> slapper.

Correct momentum equation. But wouldn't we be more concerned about kinetic
energy here? It's the energy conservation that's going to mess you up if you
crash.

KE = 1/2 * m * v^2

With your numbers:

KE-tim = (950/2)(100)^2 = 4,750,000 energy units
KE-vaughn = (400/2)(140)^2 = 3,920,000 energy units (82% of KE-tim @ 100)

At 60 mph
KE-tim = (950/2)(60)^2 = 1,710,000 energy units (238% of KE-vaughn @ 60)
KE-vaughn = (400/2)(60)^2 = 720,000 energy units (18% of KE-vaughn @ 140)

--
Jamin
"Freedom costs a buck-oh-five"




--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
 >> Stay informed about: Weekend Sport Riding Report - Finishing off a Pilot Power 

"Vaughn" wrote in message


>
> I only ride really fast when there is a clear and relatively safe
> space to do it. Just because I had a great 300 mile ride, does not
> mean I was committing the horrendous and gorssly irresponsible crime
> of speeding the whole time. I only do that when it is clear, because
> I value my life and the lives of others.
>

As one of our old regulars says, "Admit nothing."
Especially when it comes to exceeding the speed limit.




--

Andrew
00 Daytona
00 Speed Triple
71 Kawi H1
05 Kiddo
 >> Stay informed about: Weekend Sport Riding Report - Finishing off a Pilot Power 

"saddlebag" wrote in message

> On Sep 19, 6:19 pm, "tomor...@erols.com" wrote:
>> On Sep 19, 5:17 pm, saddlebag wrote:
>>
>> > Timsey, I've read your latest Bike Week story where you posted an avg
>> > mph of better than 90 from a reliable gps source.
>>
>> No, no you haven't. You're purely making that up. The only GPS
>> source I've listed in ANY report that I've posted for motorcycling
>> lists one moving average of 77.5 mph and another of 76.8 mph and
>> that's on ALL interstate travel, where the speed limit is 65-70 mph
>> the entire length of the trip.
>>
>> http://tinyurl.com/2ts8mf
>
> Oh, except for that max speed of 108 mph I guess you're right.
>
>> So, now that you've been proven a liar once again, let's address the
>> rest of your ridiculous huffing and puffing.
>>
>> > If I recall
>> > correctly, momentum = mass * velocity. You pushing a 950 lb bike at
>> > 100 mph = 95000 units of momentum.
>>
>> Oops. Another lie. My bike weighs 770 pounds wet, not 950 pounds.
>
> 780 per the Harley site, but that's before you put the trunk on it and
> loaded it down for a week long trip. I'll give you 850 lbs, but you'd
> still have to shed about 75% more energy than Vaughn.
>
>> > That energy must be shed via your
>> > shitty Harley brakes that will probably warp the first time you had to
>> > try it.
>>
>> Oops, another lie. My bike has dual full floating Brembo rotors,
>> stainless steel brake lines, and a Nissin master cylinder. The stock
>> (Japanese SunStar) rotors warped, the Screaming Eagle "floating"
>> Japanese SunStar "high performance" rotors (which were NOT floating)
>> warped. These genuine Brembo rotors do not warp.
>
> That's good. When you replace the warped frame at least you can reuse
> the brake gear.
>
>> > Vaughn OTOH, has a 400 lb bike driving 140 mph which gives
>> > him 56000 units of momentum to shed with genuine sportbike brakes MADE
>> > for stopping from high speed. I'm sure little miss mini van wouldn't
>> > expect either of you closing in on her from either speed and may well
>> > pull into either of your paths. Thing is, Vaughn has a much better
>> > chance of changing direction since his bike was made for it. Your
>> > Harley's mild steel frame would just twist and put you into a tank
>> > slapper.
>>
>> Well, since I'll never ride my Harley OR my Ducati at or near triple
>> digit speeds approaching a grade level intersection, your attempt to
>> take a general observation and apply it to a specific situation is
>> invalid.
>
> Nice caveat, but I don't recall Vaughn saying that he did either.
>
>> > Me thinks your Republican bred hypocrisy is showing.
>>
>> And I think your liberal, proven to be lying, jackASS is hanging out
>> again.
>
> No, you've spent more time and money than Ken Starr trying to catch me
> misleading the public, but the best you'll ever get if you're lucky is
> a pic of me in the back of a van with 4 smokin hot bitches sippin on
> gin and juice.
>

Tanquery I hope!

--

Andrew
00 Daytona
00 Speed Triple
71 Kawi H1
05 Kiddo
 >> Stay informed about: Weekend Sport Riding Report - Finishing off a Pilot Power 

"TroytheTroll" wrote in message

>
>>>>> Got any representative pictures?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Not here......I'll see if i can find some....or better still, I'm off
>>>> for a ride on Friday and I'll take the camera. I can e-mail them to
>>>> you?
>>>
>>> Sure, unless you would rather just post them yourself? It would be nice
>>> to see what you get to ride.
>>
>> You could always mail them to Phil's attorney, I'm sure he'll get them to
>> Troy.
>>
>> --
>> Andrew
>
> Just HAD to bring up he who shan't be named, eh Andrew?

I just did it so the newbies realize we had to fight to take this group
back.
It was a long hard battle, but the mission was accomplished, and they now
have the right to post whatever they want, wherever they want it. Props to
the ol fat bastard for freeing us slaves from he who can't be named.

Long live freedom.

--
 >> Stay informed about: Weekend Sport Riding Report - Finishing off a Pilot Power 

On Sep 19, 7:02 pm, saddlebag wrote:
> On Sep 19, 6:19 pm, "tomor...@erols.com" wrote:
>
> > On Sep 19, 5:17 pm, saddlebag wrote:
>
> > > Timsey, I've read your latest Bike Week story where you posted an avg
> > > mph of better than 90 from a reliable gps source.
>
> > No, no you haven't. You're purely making that up. The only GPS
> > source I've listed in ANY report that I've posted for motorcycling
> > lists one moving average of 77.5 mph and another of 76.8 mph and
> > that's on ALL interstate travel, where the speed limit is 65-70 mph
> > the entire length of the trip.
>
> >http://tinyurl.com/2ts8mf
>
> Oh, except for that max speed of 108 mph I guess you're right.

"Except?" WTF are you smoking? No one said ANYTHING about top speed.
>
> > So, now that you've been proven a liar once again, let's address the
> > rest of your ridiculous huffing and puffing.
>
> > > If I recall
> > > correctly, momentum = mass * velocity. You pushing a 950 lb bike at
> > > 100 mph = 95000 units of momentum.
>
> > Oops. Another lie. My bike weighs 770 pounds wet, not 950 pounds.
>
> 780 per the Harley site, but that's before you put the trunk on it and
> loaded it down for a week long trip. I'll give you 850 lbs, but you'd
> still have to shed about 75% more energy than Vaughn.

No, wrong again, dumbass. Vaughn's bike is empty in your stupid
scenario; so is mine. But remember, Vaughn's bike is going 140mph.
He said so.
>
> > > That energy must be shed via your
> > > shitty Harley brakes that will probably warp the first time you had to
> > > try it.
>
> > Oops, another lie. My bike has dual full floating Brembo rotors,
> > stainless steel brake lines, and a Nissin master cylinder. The stock
> > (Japanese SunStar) rotors warped, the Screaming Eagle "floating"
> > Japanese SunStar "high performance" rotors (which were NOT floating)
> > warped. These genuine Brembo rotors do not warp.
>
> That's good. When you replace the warped frame at least you can reuse
> the brake gear.

My frame won't warp from firm braking, dumbass.

> > > Vaughn OTOH, has a 400 lb bike driving 140 mph which gives
> > > him 56000 units of momentum to shed with genuine sportbike brakes MADE
> > > for stopping from high speed. I'm sure little miss mini van wouldn't
> > > expect either of you closing in on her from either speed and may well
> > > pull into either of your paths. Thing is, Vaughn has a much better
> > > chance of changing direction since his bike was made for it. Your
> > > Harley's mild steel frame would just twist and put you into a tank
> > > slapper.
>
> > Well, since I'll never ride my Harley OR my Ducati at or near triple
> > digit speeds approaching a grade level intersection, your attempt to
> > take a general observation and apply it to a specific situation is
> > invalid.
>
> Nice caveat, but I don't recall Vaughn saying that he did either.

Too bad. Your scenario. I didn't NAME anyone in my scenario,
dumbass. Vaughn said he was riding 140 mph on the straights.
>
> > > Me thinks your Republican bred hypocrisy is showing.
>
> > And I think your liberal, proven to be lying, jackASS is hanging out
> > again.
>
> No, you've spent more time and money than Ken Starr trying to catch me
> misleading the public, but the best you'll ever get if you're lucky is
> a pic of me in the back of a van with 4 smokin hot bitches sippin on
> gin and juice.

Other than the little fact of your lying repeatedly and being proven
to have been doing so in a single response.

Dumbass. Revel in it.
 >> Stay informed about: Weekend Sport Riding Report - Finishing off a Pilot Power